Sirija

[Lord Protector]

Od trampovih najbližih saradnika izgleda da je Matis jedino glas razuma, Bolton i Pompeo su loše ocenjeni. Ima jedan tekst na National Interestu o ovom novom dvojcu:

 

http://nationalinterest.org/blog/paul-pillar/the-bolton-pompeo-package-25311

 

Quote

  Bolton's method of policy formation has been to try to bully any part of the bureaucracy that does not subscribe to his personal agenda, and to try to bully away any part of the truth that does not serve his objectives.  Bolton’s objectives are characterized by never meeting a war or prospective war he didn’t like.  He still avows that the Iraq War—with all the costs and chaos it has caused, from thousands of American deaths to the birth of the group that we now know as ISIS—was a good idea.  That someone with this perspective has been entrusted with the job Bolton now has is a glaring example of how there often is no accountability in Washington for gross policy malpractice.

 

Edited April 12, 2018 by slow

[Anduril]

Odlicno sto pustaju inspektore - jedini nacin da se ovo resi.

Makronu bi bilo bolje da ne prodje kao Bler, tj. da nema neke lazne dokaze.

[Miralem]

da, jadni bler.

[vememah]

Svi huškači izmileli iz pacovskih rupa, neki dan Olbrajtova "pola miliona ubijene dece je dobra cena za ono što smo postigli", sad i ovaj govnar.

 

 

[mjone]

najbolje sto postji misljenje da su svi oni glupi i ne znaju posledie  ... a mi pametni na forumu pa se sve nerviramo sto ne vide dalje od nosa ...

[namenski]

5 minutes ago, mjone said:

najbolje sto postji misljenje da su svi oni glupi i ne znaju posledie  ... a mi pametni na forumu pa se sve nerviramo sto ne vide dalje od nosa ...

Jebalo kevu sto ih znaju ili su sposobni da ih predvide: pogledaj samo, onako ofrlje, posledice intervencija/bijenja/angazovanja vojske pa proceni i sam njihovu cuvenu mudrost u koju se uzdas.

Mozes, na primer, da se prisetis i NATO bombardovanja SRJ i njegovog trajanja preko svih planiranih rokova.

A primera ima onoliko.

Glupi su k'o kurac, kao i svaka mirnodopska vojska uostalom, ograniceni k'o balkoni...

Kako danas stvari stoje, situacija nije nista bolje ni sa diplomatijom, najvisim i srednjim esalonima vlasti, tako da se - sve u svemu - ne uzdaj mnogo u njihovu pamet^tm

[borris_]

1 hour ago, Anduril said:

Odlicno sto pustaju inspektore - jedini nacin da se ovo resi.

Makronu bi bilo bolje da ne prodje kao Bler, tj. da nema neke lazne dokaze.

 

+1

[Gandalf]

1 hour ago, Caligula said:

jbt misli li neko od njih makar u svojoj samoci na WC solji o civilima/deci/zenama koje ce biti sprzene zbog njihovih odluka?

ako uradiš jedno, ovo su negativne posledice.

ako uradiš drugo, ovo su negativne posledice.

ako ne uradiš ništa, ovo su negativne posledice.

 

šta god da (ne) uradiš, neko će da strada - na tebi je da odabereš najmanje lošu opciju. "najmanje loša opcija" zavisi od kriterija koje odabereš. ljudi koji su na odgovornim pozicijama, koji imaju moć da odlučuju o životima drugih, moraju da se suočavaju sa posledicama činjenja i nečinjenja. da u krevet odeš mirne savesti možeš samo ako nikada nisi bio u poziciji da donosiš teške odluke, i živiš u bezbednom okruženju pa možeš sa visine da posmatraš i sudiš. ili si psiho.

 

Orvel:

He identified himself with the ruling power and not with the opposition. In a gifted writer this seems to us strange and even disgusting, but it did have the advantage of giving Kipling a certain grip on reality. The ruling power is always faced with the question, ‘In such and such circumstances, what would you do?’, whereas the opposition is not obliged to take responsibility or make any real decisions. Where it is a permanent and pensioned opposition, as in England, the quality of its thought deteriorates accordingly.

http://orwell.ru/library/reviews/kipling/english/e_rkip

[Gandalf]

1 hour ago, slow said:

Od trampovih najbližih saradnika izgleda da je Matis jedino glas razuma...

Matis je bio glas razuma u Obaminoj administraciji kada se zalagao za oštriji stav kontra Iranaca, glas razuma u ovoj kada se zalaže za manje ratoboran stav. Nije se on promenio, promenile se okolnosti. jedan od razloga što ga Tramp ceni je upravo to što je Matis bio u jako lošim odnosima sa Obamom.

[vememah]

 

Još samo da za par dana objave da je u pitanju novičok i sve super.

Edited April 12, 2018 by vememah

[Eraserhead]

To je sve posledica Obamine bezmudosti oko Sirije. Sirija je dokaz da je cena neintervencije nekad veca od cene intervencije. Libija par desetina hiljada mrtvih, Sirija par stotina hiljada mrtvih.

[dillinger]

11 minutes ago, Eraserhead said:

To je sve posledica Obamine bezmudosti oko Sirije. Sirija je dokaz da je cena neintervencije nekad veca od cene intervencije. Libija par desetina hiljada mrtvih, Sirija par stotina hiljada mrtvih.

 

Sirija bez Al Kaide, Sauda, Katara, protivoklopnog naoružanja doniranog od USofA - par hiljada mrtvih probably.

[vememah]

Guardian nagovestio takve rezultate.

 

Quote

Syria attack: nerve agent experts race to smuggle bodies out of Douma

Corpses could provide vital clues for US technicians trying to establish which chemicals were used in the deadly bombing

Martin Chulov Middle East correspondent

Thu 12 Apr 2018 07.44 BST First published on Thu 12 Apr 2018 05.00 BST

Foaming at the mouth and struggling to breathe, their eyes burning, the patients overwhelmed medics in the Syrian town of Douma in the hours after 7:30pm last Saturday. By the following day, an estimated 500 people had gone to Syrian health facilities with “signs and symptoms consistent with exposure to toxic chemicals”, according to reports passed to the World Health Organisation from its partners in the country.

Even in an area numbed by months of relentless attacks, this was an unusual event. Doctors were soon treating symptoms they had not seen before. Some patients were convulsing, several had pinpoint pupils, and others had slow heartbeats that were barely keeping them alive.

 

All complained of a pungent smell, like chlorine. That industrial chemical had been dropped on Douma and the rest of the Ghouta area many times before and doctors could easily recognise its effects. But something else was killing the people, and doctors had no idea how to treat it.

 

“Something was working on the nervous system,” said a doctor who asked not to be named. “Chlorine doesn’t do that. While there was clearly chlorine on some of the people we treated, there was also something else.”

 

In the five days since, intelligence technicians have pored over satellite images, radio intercepts and flight paths to try to establish what happened in Douma. In Jordan, officials prepared to receive biological samples from some of the estimated 42 dead and the hundreds more who survived.

 

Smuggling routes in and out of Damascus are well travelled, and makeshift crossings along the watertight Jordanian border can suddenly open whenever there’s a need. Getting samples, especially corpses, to laboratories has been a top priority this week as the US has tried to establish if the gas that was dropped contained more than chlorine.

 

“Blood and urine will show that for up to a week, maybe longer,” said one official who had examined samples taken from patients after the sarin strikes in Ghouta in August 2013 and in Khan Sheikhoun in April last year. “[Nerve agents] degrade very quickly in situ though. If there was going to be a productive fact-finding mission, they would need to get there immediately.”

 

Jerry Smith, who led the UN mission to supervise the withdrawal of the Syrian government’s stockpile of sarin in late 2013, said the symptoms displayed by patients could suggest exposure to an agent in addition to chlorine. “It’s worth elucidating the knowns,” he said. “Casualty rates, apparent speed of death and the shaking.” Organophosphate-based poison, including sarin, causes such symptoms. Pinpoint pupils and severe mouth foaming have been telltale signs in past attacks.

In Paris, London and Washington this week, intelligence agencies studied videos from the scene of most of the deaths. US officials said they seemed similar to images taken in the aftermath of the two confirmed sarin strikes, both of which had generated widespread condemnation of the Syrian regime.

By Tuesday, US officials were suggesting that the bomb that hit the three-storey residential building in Douma contained both chlorine and a nerve agent.

Military officials in all three capitals insisted the bomb had been dropped from one of two Syrian government helicopters that had taken off from the Dumayr airbase north of Douma 30 minutes earlier. Its flight path was mapped. But local spotters in Douma had logged the arrival of two helicopters. Syrian and Russian planes had been flying bombing runs over the area since Friday night.

At the same time, ground forces had been trying, without success, to break into Douma, the last opposition stronghold at the gates of Damascus (the other two strongholds in the Ghouta district had been recaptured during the previous fortnight). Douma’s resident militia, Jaish al-Islam, had defied Russian and Syrian demands to negotiate a departure. The grand prize of reclaiming one of the last substantial chunks of the capital to remain outside state control had remained elusive. In the hours after the strike, that changed. Jaish al-Islam agreed to evacuate the area for northern Syria.

Russian troops entered Douma on Tuesday and inspected the house where most people died. Before they arrived, rescuers had taken videos of a large yellow cylinder on the roof of the building. The cylinder’s nose had been crushed by impact. A rooftop video taken by a first responder was corroborated by the online investigative site Bellingcat as having been taken on top of that building. Images of a second shell taken in a bedroom could not be definitively linked to the same house.

Both shells were very similar to cylinders that had been widely used in Ghouta and elsewhere in Syria to drop chlorine bombs. There were no obvious modifications to either, leaving officials in Washington and Europe scrambling to understand what could have caused such widespread death and injury.

“We’re looking at the possibility that there were separate canisters inside the cylinder,” said one regional official. “[The contents] cannot be mixed, because that would be volatile and unstable, but they can be combined. That’s a working theory – that they were in the same cylinder but kept separately. The point of detonation dispersed them together. We’ve seen this happen elsewhere in the country, but it didn’t cause a death toll like this. We’re in this situation because those poor people were trapped in a basement where they had no chance.”

 

 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/apr/12/syria-attack-experts-check-signs-nerve-agent

Edited April 12, 2018 by vememah

[vememah]

 

 

Edited April 12, 2018 by vememah

[mackenzie]

40 minutes ago, Eraserhead said:

To je sve posledica Obamine bezmudosti oko Sirije. Sirija je dokaz da je cena neintervencije nekad veca od cene intervencije. Libija par desetina hiljada mrtvih, Sirija par stotina hiljada mrtvih.

 

Bitno je da imaju demokratiju, nema veze što je Obama stvorio prvu robovlasničku državu i to u 21. vijeku kada i jedna Mauritanija odbacuje takve relikte. Sad je sve super i sve pet. 

 

Quote

Executions, torture and slave markets persist in Libya: U.N.

GENEVA (Reuters) - Armed groups execute and torture civilians in Libya in almost complete impunity seven years after the revolution that toppled Muammar Gaddafi, the United Nations human rights office said on Wednesday.

Libyans and migrants are often held incommunicado in arbitrary detention in appalling conditions, and reports persist of captured migrants being bought and sold on “open slave markets”, it said in a report to the Human Rights Council.

Libya is split between rival governments in the east and west while ports and beaches are largely in the hands of armed groups who smuggle mainly African migrants onto boats heading for Italy and Europe.

“Extrajudicial and unlawful killings are rampant,” Andrew Gilmour, U.N. Assistant Secretary-General for Human Rights, told the Geneva forum.

A video emerged on Jan 24 purportedly showing a special forces field commander Mahmoud al-Werfalli shooting 10 blindfolded men kneeling with their hands tied behind their back, he said. Reuters could not independently confirm the gunman’s identity.

 

Werfalli, a special forces commander attached to Khalifa Haftar’s Libyan National Army (LNA), has been indicted by the International Criminal Court (ICC) for allegedly overseeing the summary execution of several dozen prisoners.

“In what has become an increasing pattern in and around Benghazi over the last two years, more bodies with signs of torture and hands bound were found in the streets,” Gilmour said.

Armed groups are “the main perpetrators of grave human rights violations and act with almost complete impunity”, he said.

 

Detention centers run by armed groups, “including those with links to ministries” have the worst record, he said.

Adel Shaltut, charge d’affaires at Libya’s mission to the U.N. in Geneva, said: “Libya is a victim of illegal migration, it is only a transit country and cannot shoulder all responsibilities. Our coast guards and border guards do not have capacity to face organized crime and terrorism.”

The European Union said that migrants and activists were subjected to “unlawful detentions, abductions, torture, forced labor and sexual and gender-based violence”.

“We are deeply also concerned about reports of migrants and refugees allegedly being sold as slaves and call on the Libyan authorities to investigate and hold persons responsible for those acts accountable,” said EU diplomat Carl Hallergard.

Hanan Salah, Libya researcher for Human Rights Watch, denounced “raging impunity”, adding: “A political settlement and any semblance of rule of law seem elusive.”

 

She urged the Council to appoint an independent expert on the country, adding: “Given the gravity of the situation on the ground in Libya, how can this Council justify the lack of a dedicated monitoring and reporting mechanism?”.