Biden / Trump - Americki izbori 2020

[אַף אֶחָד]

Dakle, za tebe je ovaj mladac za Camp Auschwitz duksom antisemita? Nesto kao Roald Dahl? Ili Corbyn? Ili Tolkien (kladim se da nisi znao da je i njemu prisivana etiketa)?

 

Naravno da to ne mislis, nego si ga tagovao jednom recju, u odredjenom kontekstu, i bez razmisljanja. Antisemitizam je jednako kompleksan fenomen kao i fasizam i tu postoji mnogo nijansi sive.

 

Svi smo skloni da upotrebimo odredjeni kratki tag u dnevnoj komunikaciji i javnom diskursu. Zahvaljujuci obrazovanju i inteligenciji u stanju smo da taj tag stavimo u kontekst i razumemo (manje ili vise) ispravno.

 

 

[Anonymous]

22 minutes ago, Joe D said:

protestanti su svi do jednog sledbenici trampovog kulta licnosti. da li su neonacisti, qanonovci, pederi, gruzini, manje bitno, oni su homogenizovani oko vodje. pokusaj uvodjenja protesta iz beograda u ovu pricu je bezvezno razvodnjavanje rasprave, nigde jedne slicnosti izmedju dva dogajanja naroda. 

 

Mislio sam na ove naše letošnje demostracije kad sam pominjao tri skupine.

[bradilko]

ovde se samo radi o tome da kad vidis sta prica tramp i onda dodjes da ga podrzis ti se slazes u velikoj meri sa njegovim recima a njegove reci su znamo otprilike kakve.

da li neko nosi majice ovakve ili onaakve to i nije bitno. 

onaj sa ausvic majicom taman je na pravom mestu za njega. 

[Filozof manijak]

Meni si postavio pitanje ili Weeniu?

 

@chandra

Edited January 8, 2021 by Filozof manijak

[Anonymous]

23 minutes ago, duma said:

Siguran si da među navijačima niko nije imao naci simbolle? Onih koji se lože na Holokaust u Srbiji nikad nije bi veliki broj (ne znam nijednog), ali verovatno je među navijačima bio poneki. Ovo važi ako izuzmemo one s bradama i kokardama(koje verovatno računaš u fašiste). Ako računama i njih bilo je itekako mnogo fašista.

Nije bilo ni na Majdanu naci simbolal? Oni se već više lože da su arijevci, pa je za očekivati da takvih bude više. Za očekivati je da i u SAD bude više nego ovde.

Na CNN-u nije to bilo, ali u realnosti je bilo svakakvih i to u prvim redovima. Samo ko je hteo da vidi.

Za 5.X baš niko ne može da me ubedi, jer sam svojim očima video kakvih je sve bilo. Još samo da neko kaže da 5.X nije bilo ni pristalica četnika, pa da se sit nasmejem.

 

Podsećanja radi na forumu su Đilasa rutinski proglašavali za fašistu. Mnogi svakog ko je desno od njih proglase za fašistu. To nije antifašizam, već teška relativizacija fašizma.

 

Ja ne razumem zašto sad uvodiš Majdan u priču kad ga uopšte nisam pomenuo? Pokušao sam da budem precizan.

[Weenie Pooh]

2 minutes ago, chandra said:

Dakle, za tebe je ovaj mladac za Camp Auschwitz duksom antisemita? Nesto kao Roald Dahl? Ili Corbyn? Ili Tolkien (kladim se da nisi znao da je i njemu prisivana etiketa)?

 

Naravno da to ne mislis, nego si ga tagovao jednom recju, u odredjenom kontekstu, i bez razmisljanja. Antisemitizam je jednako kompleksan fenomen kao i fasizam i tu postoji mnogo nijansi sive.

 

Svi smo skloni da upotrebimo odredjeni kratki tag u dnevnoj komunikaciji i javnom diskursu. Zahvaljujuci obrazovanju i inteligenciji u stanju smo da taj tag stavimo u kontekst i razumemo (manje ili vise) ispravno.

 

Pretpostavljam da je ovo bilo upućeno meni?

 

U pravu si, ovlaš sam ga etiketirao bez mnogo razmišljanja jer je neko direktno pitao "šta je za vas ovaj sa Aušvic majicom". Meni je tu prva asocijacija antisemitizam a ne fašizam.

 

Antisemitizam je daleko lakše ustanoviti jer je tu u pitanju bias, jednostavan i individualan. A fašizam je skup ideologija, tip društvenog uređenja, i kao takav mnogo kompleksniji.

 

Naravno, pozivanje na antisemitizam može takođe biti debilno, kao u Dahl/Tolkien slučajevima (primenjivanje modernih standarda sto godina unazad). A može biti i sasvim cinično ali uspešno, kao u Corbyn slučaju koji pominješ   Mene, ipak, mnogo više žuljaju pozivanja na fašizam jer tu uvek postoji šira društvena konotacija, koja kod antisemitizma može ali ne mora biti prisutna.

[Joe D]

2 minutes ago, Anonymous said:

 

Mislio sam na ove naše letošnje demostracije kad sam pominjao tri skupine.

ma ja se nadovezujem na tvoj post, znam na sta si mislio. 

[Weenie Pooh]

[mlatko]

Inviato dal mio Mi 9 Lite utilizzando Tapatalk

[Redoran]

55 minutes ago, Moonwalker said:

 

Tek ce za ovo da se vidi. Kazu neki komentari da je medju masom  bilo aktivne policije i bezbednjak koja je bila off duty i koji su pokazivali sluzbene ID. Ne znam da li se to racuna u ovo sto si pomenuo, mozd i ne jer su zastupali sebe. Prilicno lici na stvari koje su se nama, nazalost desavale.

 

То ми све делује као пасивна и веома ограничена подршка. Прави пуч подразумева делове војске који се стављају на Трампову страну и преузимају институције. Или макар милион људи на улици који раде то исто па нема те војске која може да их задржи. С тим што ово друго у Америци не би било довољно, она је сувише велика земља да би у њој било могуће извршити државни преврат у једном граду односно у једној институцији. Пуч, поготово у Америци, мора да захвати много шире и да укључи много више актера. Овде ничега од тога није било. То што су неки пандури и безбедњаци ван дужности дошли да се прикључе јер су на тој идеолошкој линији, не мења много на ствари. Ту није било никакве активне подршке која мора да дође са кључних места у кључним институцијама. То је напросто био неки ретардирани излив беса каквих ће у будућности готово извесно бити још.

[vememah]

Quote

Donald Trump fans cry betrayal as he rebukes Capitol violence

On Parler and 4chan Trumpists write of feeling ‘like puking’ as president says those who ‘broke law will pay’

Donald Trump’s belated “concession” to a peaceful and orderly transition of power after the storming of the US Capitol has provoked anger and conspiracy theories among some of his most ardent followers.

On social media channels and chatrooms like Parler and 4chan, where far-right Trumpists have gravitated as other social media sites have increasingly shut out the president, there were complaints of betrayal.

Trump claimed on Thursday that he was “outraged by the violence, lawlessness and mayhem” of the Capitol siege that he had incited, and said those who “broke the law will pay” – comments that perhaps reflected concern over mounting legal and political hazard rather than a newfound sense of contrition and integrity.

Nevertheless they prompted an outpouring of anger, grief and denial from his hardline acolytes. “A punch in the gut,” said one. “A stab in the back,” another railed. From a third: “I feel like puking.”

A widely shared screengrab summed up the sentiment: “He says it’s going to be wild and when it gets wild he calls it a heinous attack and middle-fingers to his supporters he told to be there.”

Others turned to conspiracy theories, not least in the dark corners of 4chan and Parler, where the cult of QAnon holds sway. Many here saw not a Trump concession but either a “deep fake” video concocted by Trump’s enemies, or secret messages that indicated Trump was still on track to deliver on QAnon’s deranged promises.

“FAK fake fake He’s been locked out of his Twitter he can’t get into it he couldn’t get into it he couldn’t get into today it’s been closed out for ever,” opined someone called Magafree. “He has a plan here President Trump would not back down that easily,” wrote Brenda. “We need to stand strong, keep watch and pray. Something big is coming and Gid [God] is going to see it through.”

The reactions of the more mainstream elements of the Trump-era echo chamber have been more instructive. Sites such as Breitbart and the Daily Caller appear to have swung behind an emerging Republican consensus that has become increasingly hostile to Trump, blaming him not only for the storming of the Capitol, but also for delivering the presidency, the House of Representatives, and, earlier this week, the Senate to the Democrats.

Breitbart’s main story on Trump’s concession video was delivered in a relatively straight way, although the site tried to spin it as a Trump “change of tone”, suggesting all he had done was “return to his campaign theme of law and order”.

The comments below were, however, rather less mannered and careful. “There will NEVER be ‘reconciliation’,” wrote Freedomring17. “We have irreconcilable differences, and the fight has just begun. We need to disown the RNC until they support the Patriot party.”

For “NMP” the consequence was obvious and Trump part of the problem. “He could have declared martial law, like [Michael] Flynn said, instead he got patroits [sic] to show their face and they did and now they know who they are looking for.”

For the bitter-enders, like TrumpSupporterLTD, the sentiments were of a piece with the QAnon crowd over on 4chan – an almost metaphysical belief that Trump, despite the wealth of evidence, continues to move in mysterious ways

“Trump did not concede. He used language to buy a little extra time because the senators and congressmen who support him are being threatened with dirty bombs and their families’ lives by the Deep State and/or communist Chinese … I have it on good grounds that Trump will be moving with the military And regarding the transition to a new administration, means Trump with a new VP Pence is obviously a traitor and is ‘fired’.”

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/jan/08/trump-incites-anger-among-acolytes-let-down-by-lack-of-support

Edited January 8, 2021 by vememah

[vememah]

 

 

[vememah]

 

 

 

[Baldrick S.]

 
A day after members of Congress were relocated to secure locations as a mob of Trump supporters stormed the Capitol, raising fears about widespread transmission of the coronavirus, a House member revealed on Thursday that he had tested positive for the virus.
Representative Jake LaTurner, Republican of Kansas, announced on Twitter — hours after sharing space with colleagues on the House floor throughout a late-night session to confirm President-elect Joseph R. Biden Jr.’s Electoral College victory — that he had received a positive test, prompting further concern that the virus might have spread more widely.
While in lockdown on Wednesday, Representative Susan Wild, Democrat of Pennsylvania, told CBS News by phone that “about half” of the people sheltering in the secure location in the Capitol complex had refused to wear masks, even though masks were made available. When asked which lawmakers had declined to cover their faces, Ms. Wild said they had been “people from the Republican delegation.”
“It’s what I would call a Covid superspreader event,” she said. “It’s exactly the kind of situation that we’ve been told by the medical doctors not to be in, you know — close proximity — especially with people who aren’t wearing masks.”
It was not immediately clear whether Mr. LaTurner had been in the same location as Ms. Wild, though Ms. Wild said roughly 300 to 400 people were being held in the room with her.
 

https://www.nytimes.com/live/2021/01/07/us/electoral-vote?name=styln-transition&region=TOP_BANNER&block=storyline_menu_recirc&action=click&pgtype=Article&impression_id=4564f5f0-519a-11eb-bb2c-5586c476384f&variant=1_Show#lawmakers-fear-a-coronavirus-outbreak-after-sharing-close-quarters-in-lockdown
Ovi što su testirani pozitivno a članovi su kongresa ili senata su najverovatnije odbili da se vakcinisu, pošto su članovi oba doma vakcinisani medju prvima u Americi, zarad očuvanja "kontinuiteta vladavine".

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[3opge]

David Ignatius at the Washington Post offers this analysis of went wrong with Wednesday’s security operation in DC – but pins the blame squarely with Republicans:

The FBI underestimated the number of protesters, predicting a maximum of 20,000, which turned out to be less than half the number who showed up. The Capitol Police didn’t stand their ground at the perimeter or at the Capitol itself. The mayor was slow to request additional troops from the D.C. National Guard. The acting attorney general was similarly tardy in ordering elite FBI units into the Capitol. And the Pentagon brass worried more about avoiding politicization of the military than about stopping an insurrection.

But as we look for who to blame in this catastrophe, let’s focus on the real culprits: President Trump, who incited the rioters and urged them toward the Capitol; the 13 Republican senators and 138 House members who challenged President-elect Joe Biden’s victory and egged on the insurgents; and the smug, self-appointed patriots who trashed the people’s house. Trump should face legal action for fomenting this riot. The members who risked the lives of their colleagues by encouraging the fanatics should be censured. The insurgents who ransacked the Capitol should be arrested and prosecuted.