Avionski udesi i nesreće

[Frile]

Na y osi grafikona su pomaci frekvencije predajnika na avionu (delta f) nastali zbog doplerovog efekta. Proporcionalni su relativnoj brzini aviona u odnosu na satelit.

[Aion]

Na y osi grafikona su pomaci frekvencije predajnika na avionu (delta f) nastali zbog doplerovog efekta. Proporcionalni su relativnoj brzini aviona u odnosu na satelit.

Kako su na osnovu doplerovog efekta (promene frekvencije u usled razlike brzine aviona i satelita) mogli da iskljuce severnu rutu. Cak ako je moguce precizno odrediti rastojanje aviona od satelita u trenutku prijema signala (a nije) sve verovatnoce nalazenja njegove pozicije koje bi se bazirale na proracunu prema doplerovom efektu bi bile simetricne u odnosu na pravac kretanja satelita.

[Frile]

To se i ja pitam svo vreme, na osnovu čega su odbacili severnu rutu...  

 

Na osnovu grafikona sa prethodne strane, u nedostatku potpunih informacija o metodi koju su koristili, pada mi na pamet da su imali podatke o pingovima (tačnije frequency shiftove usled doplerovog efekta) sa nekoliko 777 koji su išli standardnim komercijalnim rutama (južnom za Australiju i severoistočnom za Evropu), standardnom brzinom od 450 čvorova. Te komercijalne rute nisu simetrične. Onda su pingove sa MH370 stavili na isti grafikon, i gle potrefilo se sa podacima sa južne komercijalne rute, znači avion je manje više išao tom rutom, kraj priče. Pokušavam da pogodim njihov način rezonovanja.

 

 

(Mala korekcija: u odnosu na pravac kretanja satelita u odnosu na položaj satelina. Satelit je (skoro) stacionaran, minimalno se pomera po osi sever jug, a te brzine pomeranja i položaji su naravno poznati.)

Edited March 29, 2014 by Frile

[Indy]

Da ne prodje nezapazeno, vazna polemika o kradenim pasosima...

 

 

on Wednesday Malaysian Interior minister Zahid Hamidi told parliament in Kuala Lumpur that consulting the database was too time consuming for immigration officers and caused airport delays.

Interpol shot back saying Malaysia?s decision to not consult the database before allowing travellers to enter the country or board planes "cannot be defended by falsely blaming technology or Interpol".

"If there is any responsibility or blame for this failure, it rests solely with Malaysia's Immigration Department," the France-based organisation said.

Interpol said that it takes "just seconds to reveal whether a passport is listed, with recent tests providing results in 0.2 seconds".

[Aion]

Za racunanje doplerovog efekta nije potrebno bilo kakvo poredjenje sa drugim letovima, to je trivijalna formula. Mislim da se ovde radi o nestrucnosti novinara koji se uhvate necega sto im zvuci poznato, a sto je pomenuto od nekog eksperta. Saamo nagadjam, ali mislim da se ovde radi o promeni oblika signala (ili spektra, ako se posmatramo frekventni domen) usled uticaja atmosfere (koja se ponasa kao filter). Onda ima smisla porediti primljeni signal sa signalom iz drugih istovetnih predajnika. Doperlerov afekat ovde samo dodje kao slag na tortu koji ce jos vise da iskomplikuje analizu.

Edited March 29, 2014 by Aion

[Frile]

Za racunanje doplerovog efekta nije potrebno bilo kakvo poredjenje sa drugim letovima, to je trivijalna formula.

 

Naravno, ni meni nije bilo jasno šta su kog đavola poredili. Oni sami (Inmarsat) pričaju o poređenju sa drugim letovima. Novinari samo prenose njihovu priču (i ovaj grafik). Nigde nisam našao priču ni eksperta niti polueksperta koji pokušava da analizira kako je su stručnjaci iz Inmarsata analizirali signale.

 

Mislim da nema šanse da su beleženi ikakvi podaci o spektru signala, to je običan komunikacioni satelit. Beležena je samo tačna frekvencija primljenog signala, a na y osi je običan delta f.

 

Ma smem se kladiti da su u Inmarsatu analizirali podatke koja su imali (radijalnu brzinu  i rastojanje od satelita), nisu mogli puno da zaključe na osnovu toga, a onda se neko setio da to uporedi sa istim podacima sa letova duž komercijalnih ruta. Slučajno se poklopilo sa južnom rutom (ista radijalna brzina i odstojanje u odgovarajućim trenucima) pa su tako "zaključili" da je tuda leteo. Sad opet koja je to komercijalna ruta koja prolazi par hiljada km od Australije i ide dalje na jug?... Što je više pitanja, manje je odgovora.

[Aion]

Ma sigurno da ne snimaju spektar, ali promena u spektru najverovatnije utice na ocitavanje frekvencije u prijemnuku (a to se da izmodelirati). Pretpostavljam da nije nista jednostavno i da nije slucajno sto im je trbalo ovoliko vremena da izadju sa nekim podacima.

[namenski]

Northwest Orient Airlines Flight 2501

[Muwan]

Flying Tiger 739

[Prospero]

Malaysia corrects last words from Flight MH370

 

Kuala Lumpur (AFP) - Malaysia's civil aviation department said late Monday the last words spoken by one of pilots of missing Flight MH370 were "Good night Malaysian three seven zero", and not the more casual "All right, good night" originally reported.

 

The admission is likely to add to criticism of the Malaysian authorities' handling of the search for the Malaysia Airlines flight which vanished on March 8 during a flight from Kuala Lumpur to Beijing.

 

Chinese relatives of those on board the missing plane have been particularly scathing, accusing Malaysia of incompetence and even a cover-up.

 

"We would like to confirm that the last conversation in the transcript between the air traffic controller and the cockpit is at 0119 (Malaysian time) and is 'Good night Malaysian three seven zero'," the department said in a statement on Monday night.

 

"The authorities are still doing forensic investigation to determine whether those last words from the cockpit were by the pilot or the co-pilot."

 

Malaysia Airlines CEO Ahmad Jauhari Yahya had said on March 17 the last words from the cockpit were believed to have been spoken by the co-pilot.

 

Shortly after the last message from the plane communications were cut and the Boeing 777, carrying mostly Chinese nationals, vanished from civilian radar.

 

The civil aviation department said a full transcript would be released during a briefing with relatives of the missing passengers.

 

- 'We are not hiding anything' -

 

The move comes after testy exchanges on Monday between foreign journalists and Malaysian Transport and Defence Minister Hishammuddin Hussein, who insisted: "We are not hiding anything, we are just following the procedure that has been set."

 

Malaysia insists it is being transparent, but has yet to release any details of its investigation into what happened, which has included probing the backgrounds of everyone on the flight, including its crew.

 

In the early days of their daily press briefings after the plane went missing, Malaysian officials made a series of contradictory statements that added to the confusion.

 

Notably, there have been about-turns regarding the crucial sequence of events in the plane's cockpit before it veered off course, and Malaysia's armed forces have been criticised for failing to intercept the diverted plane when it appeared on military radar.

 

Such mis-steps have fuelled relatives' anger, with families of Chinese passengers accusing Malaysian officials of incompetence and deceit.

 

A massive international search for the plane is currently focused on the southern Indian Ocean, where the aircraft is thought to have crashed after mysteriously veering off course.

 

Malaysian Prime Minister Najib Razak is heading to Australia to witness the race-against-time bid to locate the crash site.

 

Ships and planes from seven nations are engaged in the massive search operation in a vast zone far off western Australia but so far the hunt for debris that would prove the jet crashed in the Indian Ocean has turned up nothing.

 

Experts warn debris must be found within days to nail down a crash site in order for any use of a US-supplied black box detector -- known as a towed pinger locator (TPL) -- to be feasible.

 

The US Navy, which has supplied the detection device, said in a statement Monday: "Without confirmation of debris it will be virtually impossible to effectively employ the TPL since the range on the black-box pinger is only about a mile."

 

But Australian Prime Minister Tony Abbott said no time limit would be imposed on the search for clues as to what happened.

 

"We owe it to the families, we owe it to everyone that travels by air, we owe it to the anxious governments of the countries who had people on that aircraft. We owe it to the wider world which has been transfixed by this mystery for three weeks now," Abbott said in Perth.

 

The Australian vessel Ocean Shield, fitted with the pinger locator and an underwater drone designed to home in on the black box's signal, was set to head to the search area.

 

A black box signal usually lasts only about 30 days. Fears are mounting that time will run out -- Ocean Shield will not reach the search zone, now the size of Norway, until Thursday, roughly 26 days after the plane went missing.

 

If floating MH370 debris is found, authorities plan to analyse recent weather patterns and ocean currents to determine where the plane went down.

 

Malaysia believes MH370 was deliberately diverted by someone on board and that satellite data indicates it crashed in the remote Indian Ocean.

 

Malaysia remains officially in charge, but Australia has assumed increasing responsibility, appointing retired air chief marshal Angus Houston to head a new coordination centre in Perth.

[Prospero]

Investigators: We May Never Know What Happened to Malaysia Airlines Flight 370

BY BRIAN RIES

10 MINUTES AGO

 

 

The Malaysian police in charge of finding out what happened to Malaysia Airlines Flight 370 admitted on Wednesday something the world is beginning to fear: we may never really know what happened to the doomed jetliner and the 239 people on board.

 

 

Speaking to reporters in Kuala Lumpur, Inspector General Khalid Abu Bakar said, "Investigations may go on and on and on. We have to clear every little thing. At the end of the investigations, we may not even know the real cause. We may not even know the reason for this incident."

Malaysia's police have concluded their investigation into the 227 passengers on board the plane and have cleared them all of suspicion. The plane's crew, including senior pilot Zaharie Ahmad Shah, 53 and his co-pilot Fariq Abdul Hamid, 27, continue to be under investigation, with Shah's flight simulator being pored over by the FBI. The probe is now focused on possibilities that include a hijacking, sabotage or psychological problems among those employed by Malaysia Airlines, The Sydney Morning Herald reports. They're even looking into the plane's food to somehow ensure that it wasn't poisoned.

Inspector General Khalid Abu Bakar told reporters there was more — but he couldn't say due to the ongoing criminal investigation.

“I’m sorry, there are things we cannot reveal to you … not that I don’t want to reveal to you, but we cannot do that because it’s a criminal investigation, ongoing,” he said. “We have not concluded the whole thing and we are still awaiting reports from experts overseas and internally. Who knows, maybe there will be prosecution later on. So this will affect the prosecution’s case, if we start revealing our findings."

It's been three weeks since the Boeing 777 disappeared less than one hour after taking off from Kuala Lumpur International Airport, bound for Beijing. The pilot signed off, saying, "Good night Malaysian 370," shortly before somebody on board deliberately turned off the plane's transponder. Authorities have concluded that the plane's journey ended seven hours later somewhere in the southern Indian Ocean, and there were no survivors — but they have yet to find any debris.

[kim_philby]

ovo je to? odustaju?

[nera]

Kazu da ne odustaju:

 

PERTH, Australia, April 3 (Xinhua) -- Australian Prime Minister Tony Abbott said on Thursday that the ongoing search for missing Malaysian flight MH370 is "the most difficult in human history," while reiterating his promise to the families of those on board that his country will "spare no effort" to continue the search mission as best as they can.

[jms_uk]

 

The FBI has completed of review of the in-home flight simulator that belonged to the captain of the missing Malaysia Airlines passenger jet and found “nothing suspicious whatsoever.”

 

“They (FBI analysts) have finished with the simulator. There is nothing suspicious whatsoever about what they found,” a senior U.S. official told ABC News.

 

“There’s nothing at all (criminal) about the pilot. Right now there is zero evidence of a criminal act by the flight crew,” the official said.

ABC news

[ducca]

Navodno je uhvacen neki slabasan signal sa dna Indijskog koji odgovara frekvenciji crne kutije...