Španija i Katalonija

[Bojan]

Ono što je realnost jeste da je Pućdemonu i ministrima zaprećeno optužnicom za pobunu (rebellion), uz moguću kaznu zatvora do 30 godina, ukoliko proglase nezavisnost. Sančez, Kušar i Trapero se terete za drugo delo za koje je zaprećena kazna do 15 godina. Razlika je u terminu rebellion i sedition. Ovo drugo je valjda podstrekivanje.

 

 

U 19.30 se obraća predsednica parlamenta, a u 9 Pućdemon (kao što je već pomenuto).

 

Pućdemon ima sledeće opcije na raspolaganju:

 

1. Proglasiti nezavisnost (odnosno skinuti suspenziju)

 

2. Raspisati izbore

 

3. Dati opet neku izjavu tipa "mi smo za dijalog" i čekati da se vidi kako će Madrid operacionalizovati ono što je predvideo da uradi aktiviranjem člana 155; iza toga po potrebi stati u odbranu katalonskih institucija

[Budja]

Koliko kapiram dinamiku unutar Katalonije citajuci La Vanguardia, Ada Colau pokusava da privuce bazu katalonskih socijalista i da izdgradi most ka independistima tako da se pokret za nezavisnost transformise u siri pokret "NE clanu 155".

 

Dok su van Katalonije socijalisti legli na rudu i potpuno podrzali Rahoj uz izlive patriotizma (celnik socijalista u Kastilji), u Kataloniji su izgleda prilicno podeljeni.

[Tribun_Populi]

sto su ti skrivili ljudi?

bas ti je stalo do celovitosti spanije :D

Nisam ljubitelj secesionizama niti midžet državica nikako, a i Španci su generalno naša (ex-yu) ciganska braća, najsličniji po mentalitetu rekao bih.

 

Plus me ovo strašno podseća na rane radove raspada Jugoslavije, a i sadašnje uređenje i bliska prošlost Španije ti je zicer kontrafaktualna varijanta da je Draža pobedijo.

 

Poslato sa HUAWEI VNS-L21 uz pomoć Tapatoka

[vememah]

[Bojan]

Koliko kapiram dinamiku unutar Katalonije citajuci La Vanguardia, Ada Colau pokusava da privuce bazu katalonskih socijalista i da izdgradi most ka independistima tako da se pokret za nezavisnost transformise u siri pokret "NE clanu 155".

 

Dok su van Katalonije socijalisti legli na rudu i potpuno podrzali Rahoj uz izlive patriotizma (celnik socijalista u Kastilji), u Kataloniji su izgleda prilicno podeljeni.

 

Tako otprilike. Ovo što sam ja juče pročitao u La Vanguardia jeste njena poruka socijalistima, kao koalicionim partnerima, da ukoliko podrže odluku PSOE ne mogu više da računaju da će biti partneri sa BComu u gradskom parlamentu. Ada Colau je danas bila na protestnom okupljanju. Otpor prema Madridu će svakako učiniti da se formira jedan širi front od onoga koji podržava nezavisnost, ali će tu i dalje independisti voditi glavnu reč. Da bi se dalo prostora i nekim drugim opcijama, koje su recimo za pregovore oko autonomije neophodno je da Madrid popusti i pokaže dobru volju.

 

Ovako ljudi se ujedinjuju da brane nešto svoje, zvalo se to nezavisna država, autonomija, više od autonomije - manje od nezavisnosti ili nešto drugo.

[Bojan]

 

Uh, krenule teške reči... Po meni ne bi bilo dobro da proglašavaju nezavisnost, već da sačekaju reakciju španske vlade i pruže civilni otpor njihovim potezima.

[vememah]

El Pais i laSexta potvrđuju da je plan da centralna vlast preuzme katalonski javni servis TV3 i smeni direktora i da ukine platu onim zaposlenima koji ne budu slušali novu upravu.

https://politica.elpais.com/politica/2017/10/21/actualidad/1508598407_476671.html

 

 

Sindikati, drugi katalonski mediji i sami novinari javnog servisa glasno izražavaju nezadovoljstvo time.

 

Uh, krenule teške reči...

 

Rekla je i da su Sančez i Kuišar politički zatvorenici.

 

Puđdemon upravo govori.

 

 

- Žele da iz svojih kancelarija promene ono što su građani Katalonije odlučili glasajući. Rahoj je pokrenuo najveći napad na katalonske institucije od Franka

- Moramo braniti svoje institucije na civilizovan, miran i dostojanstven način

- Tražiću od parlamenta da se izjasni o pokušaju likvidacije naše autonomije

 

Sad govori na engleskom. I završio je sa "Živela Katalonija".

Edited October 21, 2017 by vememah

[vememah]

Dakle, za razliku od pisma Rahoju, danas nije spominjao proglašenje nezavisnosti.
 
Sve teze iz govora:
 
 

All the proposals for dialogue addressed to the Spanish state have had the same answer: either silence or repression
Today the Council of Ministers has shut the door on the demand and the request that has been asked of us by many people
This represent the removal of our self-government and the democratic will of the Catalans
What the Catalans decided in the polls the Spanish government abolishes in lawsuits.
The Spanish govt, with the support of @PSOE and @CiudadanosCs has embarked on the worst attack on Catalonia’s institutions since Franco
I'm aware of the threat that weighs above all the people of Catalonia if the State perpetuates its destructive intent
We must call upon ourselves to defend, once again, our institutions as we have always done, in a peaceful and civilized way
I will ask the Parliament to call for a session where representatives of the citizen’s sovereignty can debate and decide on this attack
I want to address a message to Europe. Not only to its leaders but to all its citizens with whom we share European citizenship
If the EU's foundational values are at risk in Catalonia, they will also be at risk in Europe.
Democratically deciding the future of a nation is not a crime. This goes against the foundations that unite European citizens
What we ask for, we do it because we believe in a democratic and peaceful Europe. The Charter of Fundament Rights should protect everyone.
What you are fighting for at home, we are also fighting for in Catalonia. And we will continue to do so

https://twitter.com/catalangov

 

[vememah]

Predlog Rahojeve vlade senatu za aktiviranje člana 155:

http://www.antena3.com/newa3flash/visorpdf/core/docs/155senado.pdf (originalni PDF)

 

http://www.antena3.com/documents/2017/10/21/D5438B22-F8D9-417F-961B-9040B4A28612/171021acuerdofin.pdf (OCR-ovani tekst)

[Budja]

Moja pretpostavka strategije katalonske vlasti na osnovu ne-spominjanja nezavisnosti:

1. DUI ce se drzati na ledu.

2. Raspisivannje izbora, ali pod sopstvenim a ne Rahojevim uslovima.

3. Aktivan otpor clanu 155 da bi se u izbore uslu uz tenziju a ne razocaranje soptvenih biraca.

Edited October 21, 2017 by Budja

[vememah]

Reklo bi se da ima dosta smisla to što kažeš.

 

Ipak, katalonska vlast pre neki dan nije htela nove izbore, a i uopšte nije sigurno da ne bi bila smenjena, mediji i mososi preuzeti i još ljudi pohapšeno ako ih raspiše. O tome odlučuje senat u kome Rahojev PP sam ima većinu, dok je u Kataloniji osvojio 9% na katalonskim, a 13% na nacionalnim izborima.

 

Serija tvitova na tu temu od pre neki dan:

 

 

I prigodna karikatura:

 

(u slučaju požara razbiti staklo)

- Prvo vi

- Ne, izvolite, prvo vi

 

Portparol PSOE Abalos tvrdi da to da li je se aktiviranje 155 reverzibilno ili ne zavisi od volje Puđdemona, tj. da se ono prekida ako Puđdemon raspiše izbore, ali u naslovu članka stoji da tom izjavom protivreči Rahoju.

 

El ‘número tres’ de la formación ha destacado que el proceso puesto en marcha este sábado será “reversible o no en función de la voluntad” de Puigdemont. Para frenar las medidas del 155 “lo tiene fácil, aceptar el marco legal y convocar elecciones”, ha remarcado.

https://okdiario.com/espana/2017/10/21/jose-luis-abalos-contradice-mariano-rajoy-dice-155-reversible-invita-carles-puigdemont-convocar-elecciones-1439926

Edited October 21, 2017 by vememah

[vememah]

[noskich]

http://commonstransition.org/the-catalan-integral-cooperative-an-organizational-study-of-a-post-capitalist-cooperative/

 

THE CATALAN INTEGRAL COOPERATIVE: AN ORGANIZATIONAL STUDY OF A POST-CAPITALIST COOPERATIVE

 

In this Commons Transition Special Report, George Dafermos documents the organizational model of one of the most interesting cooperative projects to have emerged in Europe in the age of crisis – the Catalan Integral Cooperative (CIC). 

Founded by an assembly of activists in Catalonia in 2010, the CIC’s revolutionary aspiration is to antagonize Capital by building cooperative structures in the Catalan economy. Its commitment to the principles of the Commons, Open Cooperativism and P2P, make it a prototypical example of a new generation of co-ops connecting the Commons and cooperative movements. Their position is that a truly collaborative economy can only develop when it’s commons-based.

Edited October 22, 2017 by noskich

[vememah]

Katalonski dnevnici El Periodico i La Vanguardia imaju uvodnike kojima pozivaju Puđdemona da raspiše izbore i izbegne član 155 s istom argumentacijom: nedostatak ikakve opipljive međunarodne podrške, moguće nasilje, posledice po ekonomiju... La Vanguardia uz to kritikuje maksimalističke pozicije katalonskih vlasti od 2012. i kaže da se zalagala za poštovanje ustava i dogovor.

 

http://www.lavanguardia.com/opinion/20171022/432257883536/president-posi-les-urnes.html

http://www.elperiodico.cat/ca/opinio/20171021/independencia-catalunya-president-posi-urnes-6370339

 

How the Spanish government plans to control Catalonia

 

 

AFP-JIJI

• OCT 22, 2017

MADRID – Spain announced drastic measures Saturday to stop Catalan leaders from pressing ahead with independence. What exactly do these proposals entail?

Catalan government

 

The Spanish government has asked the Senate — controlled by the ruling Popular Party — to dismiss the entire Catalan regional executive, including President Carles Puigdemont and Vice President Oriol Junqueras.

They will be replaced by nominees from the central government. Prime Minister Mariano Rajoy told reporters the idea is for national ministries to take over for as long as this “exceptional situation” lasts.

Madrid has also asked that Rajoy be given the power to dissolve the Catalan parliament and call regional elections “in a maximum time frame of six months from the Senate’s approval.”

It is not only the Catalan government that is affected. Madrid has also asked for permission to substitute anyone who works in public entities that come under the regional government if needed, such as the region’s broadcasters.

 

Catalan police force

 

Under the proposed measures, Catalonia’s regional police force, the Mossos d’Esquadra, will come under direct Madrid control.

Whoever is named to take the reins of the regional interior ministry will “give members of Catalonia’s police — the Mossos d’Esquadra — direct instructions they will have to comply with,” according to the government document setting out the plans. If necessary, members of the Catalan force can also “be replaced by state security forces.”

There is no explicit mention of Catalan police chief Josep Lluis Trapero, who faces sedition charges for allegedly failing to stop the banned independence referendum on Oct. 1. But the person put in charge of the regional interior ministry will have the power to replace him with someone else.

 

Finances

 

Madrid had already seized control of wide areas of Catalan public spending in September, seeking in vain to stop the referendum taking place.

It will now seek full control over the region’s finances, including budgets and taxes, to ensure that no public money can be spent on efforts to break away.

 

Telecommunications, media

 

“Telecommunications and digital services” will also come under Madrid’s governance.

That includes the Telecommunications and Information Technology Center, which controls all of the Catalan government’s telecoms and online services.

Under the proposed measures, the heads or employees of Catalan public media can be replaced.

The Spanish government says it wants to “guarantee the transmission of truthful, objective and balanced information, which respects political, social and cultural pluralism, and also the territorial balance.”

This means Madrid will also have a say in what is broadcast on popular Catalan television channels such as TV3. Unions at TV3 have accused the channel of broadcasting biased information in favor of independence; unions of the nationwide TVE news channel have accused it of being biased in favor of Madrid.

 

Regional parliament

 

Madrid has also proposed to take control of the Catalan parliament’s activity, where pro-independence lawmakers have an absolute majority of 72 seats out of 135.

The Spanish government has not called for Carme Forcadell, the head of the Catalan parliament and a staunch independence supporter, to be replaced.

But it stipulates the regional parliament “won’t be able to process initiatives that run counter” to the proposed measures.

In order to ensure this, the central government wants to appoint an entity that will ensure that every single text being processed through parliament conforms to the measures.

This includes bills submitted to the regional parliament until the elections.

 

https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2017/10/22/world/politics-diplomacy-world/spanish-government-plans-control-catalonia/

 

 

Edited October 22, 2017 by vememah

[vememah]

Dnevnik Ara, koji za razliku od dvojezičnih La Vanguardije i El Periodica, izlazi samo na katalonskom, ima oštriji uvodnik "Uz legitimnu vladu Katalonije" kojim se kritikuju španske vlasti, ali se takođe poziva katalonska vlada da u odbranu zemlje, institucija i demokratije raspiše plebiscitarne izbore kako bi se međunarodnoj zajednici jasno potvrdili rezultati, kako naglašava, "herojskog referenduma".

http://www.ara.cat/opinio/legitim-govern-Catalunya_0_1892210908.html

 

Ovo je slika koja prati uvodnik:

 

Edited October 22, 2017 by vememah