vememah Posted March 12, 2020 Posted March 12, 2020 2 minutes ago, Joe D said: niko ih nema dovoljno. negde sam procitao da nemacka ima 30000. Nemačka ima 28.000 kreveta intenzivne nege, čisto sumnjam da su baš svi opremljeni respiratorima.
ZerrorR Posted March 12, 2020 Posted March 12, 2020 4 hours ago, tonyk said: Zatvorena škola u Irigu. 2 slučaja. Lični izvor, bez detalja. Panduri, doktori u zaštitnim odelima u školi, 50 automobila da pokupi decu kući rano jutros. Whole nine yards. Matori mi zivi tamo.
Joe D Posted March 12, 2020 Posted March 12, 2020 Just now, vememah said: Nemačka ima 28.000 kreveta intenzivne nege, čisto sumnjam da su baš svi opremljeni respiratorima. moguce da sam taj podatak procitao.
goofs Posted March 12, 2020 Posted March 12, 2020 ^^ Aj nemojte leba vam o svevisnjem kineskom drzavnom aparatu.
braca Posted March 12, 2020 Posted March 12, 2020 1 minute ago, vememah said: Što jes', jes'. Svi poznati virusi dosad su se zaustavljali na državnim granicama, ovaj je potpuno iznenadio ceo svet. Posebno kad imamo u vidu da je Kina crna rupa iz koje ne dolaze nikakve informacije pa i dalje niko ne zna kojom magijom su ga Kinezi zaustavili zbog čega je njihovo iskustvo apsolutno neprimenljivo bilo gde drugde. Pa pisao je bane direkt iz Kine kako su ga zaustavili : svi kod kuće, nepohodne namirnice dovoze do zgrade, i čekali da prodje Službe dezinfikovale šta su mogle, od ulica do prevoza
Lo Zingaro Posted March 12, 2020 Posted March 12, 2020 4 minutes ago, vememah said: Nemačka ima 28.000 kreveta intenzivne nege, čisto sumnjam da su baš svi opremljeni respiratorima. Plus niko ne racuna da vec postoje ljudi koji su na intenzivnoj i iz drugih razloga. Plus treba i strucno osoblje da pokrije sve te krevete i aparate.
Frile Posted March 12, 2020 Posted March 12, 2020 braco, čini mi se da je vememah bio sarkastičan, zbog tvrdnje da "niko nije mogao da predvidi ovakav razvoj situacije"
vememah Posted March 12, 2020 Posted March 12, 2020 (edited) 7 minutes ago, goofs said: ^^ Aj nemojte leba vam o svevisnjem kineskom drzavnom aparatu. Dobro, evo da ti repriziram krivu po kojoj se kreću praktično sve zapadnoevropske zemlje pa ti sam zaključi kuda vode mere koje su dosad primenjene u njima: Plus je bilo ono istraživanje po kojem nedelju dana odlaganja sprovođenja radikalnih mera dovodi do udesetorostručavanja broja slučajeva. Prava sitnica. Edited March 12, 2020 by vememah
ordi Posted March 12, 2020 Posted March 12, 2020 1 hour ago, Ayatollah said: Moja žena je zvala jutros kontakt centar za Covid 19, i na kraju se posvađala sa doktorkom sa druge strane. Ima od sinoć suvo grlo i kašlje, te se generalno ne oseća dobro (što je kod nje doduše relativno često i bez Covida), pa je ostala kući danas i zvala broj kontakt centra, predstavila se kao koleginica - lekar specijalista i pitala na koji način treba sada da postupi, obzirom da radi ambulante i ima ležeće pacijente u bolnici. Kravetina sa druge strane telefona je prvo pitala da li je bila u Italiji ili Nemačkoj, ili u kontaktu sa nekim kome je potvrđen Covid, pa kad je ona rekla da nije, napušila je što je uopšte zvala i očiutavala je bukvicu kako je vrlo neprofesionalno što zove a prethodno nije proučila terapijski algoritam u kome se to spominje, itd. Na opasku moje žene da je ove nedelje pregledala barem 50 ambulantnih pacijenata i da ima još toliko ležećih, to da zove opreza radi, ova joj odgovorila da stavi masku i ide na posao, i da ne paniči, i kakav je ona to lekar, pa se sve završilo međusobnim pičkaranjem. Suma sumarum, od države ovde ne treba niko da očekuje apsolutno ništa, a naš zdravstveni sistem postoji samo na papiru i forme radi, što sam video prošle nedelje kad sam kevu vodao po VMA i Urgentnom zbog bubruga. Ako i preživimo koronu, to će biti uprkos državi, a ne zahvaljujući istoj. iskreno se nadam da je tvoja žena tražila ime te nazovi doktorke sa kojom je razgovarala pošto ovakvo ponašanje u mnogih lekara nije retkost sa ili bez virusa i trebalo bi da se sankcioniše.
Zabalujev Posted March 12, 2020 Posted March 12, 2020 Samo da primetim da Kinezi uspešno vode propagandni rat. Do pre par nedelja zapadni mediji su trtljali u stilu "da li će ovo biti kineski Černobilj?", sada se priča okreće na drugu stranu i respekt prema Kini na zavidnom nivou, kako kod stručnjaka, tako i kod evropskih političara. To što ćemo možda da neko vreme čekamo u redu za kafu i leba se pregrmi - ne bi nam bila prvina. Ali ako nakon ovoga ostane utisak superiornosti kineskog sistema... To neće tek tako proći. Kinezima je to svakako dugoročna strategija.
InvisibleLight Posted March 12, 2020 Posted March 12, 2020 Just now, ordi said: iskreno se nadam da je tvoja žena tražila ime te nazovi doktorke sa kojom je razgovarala pošto ovakvo ponašanje u mnogih lekara nije retkost sa ili bez virusa i trebalo bi da se sankcioniše. pa to im jeste algoritam - da se jos uvek testiraju samo ako dolaze iz zarista il su bili u dodiru nekim ko je dokazano pozitivan valjda da ne trose skupe testove na svakog ko kaslje. samo sto taj algoritam mislim pregazice vreme za par dana na stranu sto je bila gruba i 'puna razumevanja' btw i zvanicno onaj txt sto je pisan diskursom tabloidnih resenja ;ako imate ovaj simptom moguce da imate rak creva' 'soda bikarbona s limunom na 29stepeni svak idan' itd dokazano lazan https://www.raskrikavanje.rs/page.php?id=587&fbclid=IwAR1kD8p0i3OhArEfnNU7i4vMcyAeMoULyhNbwhCFI0poFrZhMyO0sUBO7SQ
vememah Posted March 12, 2020 Posted March 12, 2020 4 minutes ago, Zabalujev said: ako nakon ovoga ostane utisak superiornosti kineskog sistema... Pa ti napiši ako znaš zapadnu zemlju koja se posle početnog šoka ovako dobro organizovala kako je šef misije SZO u Kini Aylward opisao. Quote How did the Chinese reorganize their medical response? First, they moved 50 percent of all medical care online so people didn’t come in. Have you ever tried to reach your doctor on Friday night? Instead, you contacted one online. If you needed prescriptions like insulin or heart medications, they could prescribe and deliver it. But if you thought you had coronavirus? You would be sent to a fever clinic. They would take your temperature, your symptoms, medical history, ask where you’d traveled, your contact with anyone infected. They’d whip you through a CT scan … Wait — “whip you through a CT scan”? Each machine did maybe 200 a day. Five, 10 minutes a scan. Maybe even partial scans. A typical hospital in the West does one or two an hour. And not X-rays; they could come up normal, but a CT would show the “ground-glass opacities” they were looking for. (Dr. Aylward was referring to lung abnormalities seen in coronavirus patients.) And then? If you were still a suspect case, you’d get swabbed. But a lot would be told, “You’re not Covid.” People would come in with colds, flu, runny noses. That’s not Covid. If you look at the symptoms, 90 percent have fever, 70 percent have dry coughs, 30 percent have malaise, trouble breathing. Runny noses were only 4 percent. The swab was for a PCR test, right? How fast could they do that? Until recently, we were sending all of ours to Atlanta. They got it down to four hours. So people weren’t sent home? No, they had to wait. You don’t want someone wandering around spreading virus. If they were positive, what happened? They’d be isolated. In Wuhan, in the beginning, it was 15 days from getting sick to hospitalization. They got it down to two days from symptoms to isolation. That meant a lot fewer infected — you choke off this thing’s ability to find susceptibles. What’s the difference between isolation and hospitalization? With mild symptoms, you go to an isolation center. They were set up in gymnasiums, stadiums — up to 1,000 beds. But if you were severe or critical, you’d go straight to hospitals. Anyone with other illnesses or over age 65 would also go straight to hospitals. What were mild, severe and critical? We think of “mild” as like a minor cold. No. “Mild” was a positive test, fever, cough — maybe even pneumonia, but not needing oxygen. “Severe” was breathing rate up and oxygen saturation down, so needing oxygen or a ventilator. “Critical” was respiratory failure or multi-organ failure. So saying 80 percent of all cases are mild doesn’t mean what we thought. I’m Canadian. This is the Wayne Gretzky of viruses — people didn’t think it was big enough or fast enough to have the impact it does. Hospitals were also separated? Yes. The best hospitals were designated just for Covid, severe and critical. All elective surgeries were postponed. Patients were moved. Other hospitals were designated just for routine care: women still have to give birth, people still suffer trauma and heart attacks. They built two new hospitals, and they rebuilt hospitals. If you had a long ward, they’d build a wall at the end with a window, so it was an isolation ward with “dirty” and “clean” zones. You’d go in, gown up, treat patients, and then go out the other way and de-gown. It was like an Ebola treatment unit, but without as much disinfection because it’s not body fluids. How good were the severe and critical care? China is really good at keeping people alive. Its hospitals looked better than some I see here in Switzerland. We’d ask, “How many ventilators do you have?” They’d say “50.” Wow! We’d say, “How many ECMOs?” They’d say “five.” The team member from the Robert Koch Institute said, “Five? In Germany, you get three, maybe. And just in Berlin.” (ECMOs are extracorporeal membrane oxygenation machines, which oxygenate the blood when the lungs fail.) https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/04/health/coronavirus-china-aylward.html
goofs Posted March 12, 2020 Posted March 12, 2020 7 minutes ago, vememah said: Dobro, evo da ti repriziram krivu po kojoj se kreću praktično sve zapadnoevropske zemlje pa ti sam zaključi kuda vode mere koje su dosad primenjene u njima: Plus je bilo ono istraživanje po kojem nedelju dana odlaganja sprovođenja radikalnih mera dovodi do udesetorostručavanja broja slučajeva. Prava sitnica. Aha, izlecili su virus (koji su btw sami napravili) i onda su super, a oni nacisticki logori po zemlji, hong kong, vesanja i istrebljivanje slobodnog stanovnistva koje se zameri vodjama, to nista? Jel znas sta je bilo sa likom koji je samostalno i van znavnicnih medija izvestavao o Koroni jos na samom pocetku? Jel znas i sta su pokusavali da urade tada sa vestima o virusu, pa im nije poslo za rukom? Ne zajebavajte, Kina je kurac od drzave.
Ayatollah Posted March 12, 2020 Posted March 12, 2020 8 minutes ago, ordi said: iskreno se nadam da je tvoja žena tražila ime te nazovi doktorke sa kojom je razgovarala pošto ovakvo ponašanje u mnogih lekara nije retkost sa ili bez virusa i trebalo bi da se sankcioniše. Bila je toliko besna kada je završila razgovor, da sumnjam da je stigla da je pita. Sad, moguće je da grešim.
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