Trump - hoće li biti impeachment ili 8 godina drugačijeg predsednikovanja?

[theanswer]

vi niste normalni ako mislite da on puca

[roksi]

pa prvo bi trebalo da se slozimo oko definicije normalnog. 

 

ako je 'normalno' dozivljavati trampa kao americkog robin huda, meni je to moguce samo u nekom alternativnom univerzumu.

[Weenie Pooh]

Ne puca naravno, stoka tako priča i razmišlja već 70 godina, može komotno još četiri. Ali je užasno zababno gledati ga kako se koprca i opušteno lupa ko Maksim po diviziji. Dečija naivnost + staračka nadmenost FTW.

 

Inače gornji reporter ga je samo pitao da li će i kad da osudi napade na sinagoge širom USA, čak se unapred izričito ogradio da nikako ne pokušava da optuži Trampa za antisemitizam. Ali džabe, on odmah "Šta ti meni, kakva su to pitanja, ja sam najmanji antisemita ever, bio mi juče onaj vaš kako se zove, Betanjahu Bibi, sedi dole, sedi kad ti kažem..." :D

Edited February 17, 2017 by Weenie Pooh

[theanswer]

pa prvo bi trebalo da se slozimo oko definicije normalnog. 

 

ako je 'normalno' dozivljavati trampa kao americkog robin huda, meni je to moguce samo u nekom alternativnom univerzumu

 

pa poenta je u tome što je ovo potpuino normalno za trampa, kao da je sad ovo nešto što do sad nismo videli od njega? ovo je ambijent u kojem se on najbolje snalazi, konferencija za novinare, sutra miting.

 

tramp je lud kao nijedan predsednik da ga ja pamtim ali je i pokrivanje trampa kao nijednog predsednika do sada. samo pogledati sat vremena cnn-a svaki dan i sve je jasno zašto je pobedio. evo sad vrte kako je glupo što je izjavio da je nasledio mess kao predsednik, pokazuju šta je obama nasledio kakvu ekonomiju a kakva je recimo ekonomija sada. degeni kompletni iz razloga što tramp ne bi jebeno pobedio da ti njegovi glasači su zadovoljni stanjem u državi makar jebeni anderson kuper objavio 165151 podataka koji govore suprotno. bitno je šta je tim ljudima u glavama.

[hazard]

Fazon je u tome sto svi ti iz medija koji se kao zgrazavaju nad Trampom zapravo uzivaju u cinjenici da je predsednikovanje postalo 24/7 reality show. A uziva i Tramp. Upalis CNN i samo Tramp, Tramp, Tramp, Tramp. Zasluzuju jedni druge

[theanswer]

naravno. problem je što tramp kaže nekad stvari koje jesu tačne samo ne zna lepo da ih kaže kao npr oko sudske odluke za 9th circuit. to jeste liberalni sud, najliberalniji u državi, to je kao vučić što priča pitajte tužilaštvo pitajte sudove, kao on ih ne kontroliše. tako u americi vlada ta fama oko njihove posebnosti. kao sud je nezavisan. jeste nezavisan moj kurac ko što su najdemokratskija država na planeti, ko što samo oni poštuju ljudska prava i milion drugih stvari. kada ih neko dirne u to kao tramp kad je rekao pa i mi smo ubice za putina, onda je all out attack jer kako je neko i to ne neko nego predsednik hej smeo da se drzne u jebeni njihov eksepšionalizm

[iDemo]

Zaje@ano... 

[Eraserhead]

Mattis: 'Very little doubt' Russia has interfered in elections

 

http://thehill.com/policy/international/319832-mattis-very-little-doubt-russia-has-interfered-in-elections

[hazard]

 kao sud je nezavisan. jeste nezavisan moj kurac

 

Naravno da je sud nezavistan. Americko sudstvo vrlo drzi do sebe i do svoje nezavisnosti. Vrlo je moguce da nema "nezavisnijeg" sudskog sistema u zapadnom svetu. Ali isto tako nema ni "aktivistickijeg". Delom je to zbog samog pravnog sistema baziranog na obicajnom pravu koji po definiciji ostavlja veliki ulogu za sudije da intepretiraju zakon i prave presedane. No meni se cini da se u Americi to od strane sudija razvlaci do samih granica pa i zloupotrebljava. Sudije sude u skladu sa svojim ideoloskim uverenjima. Skloni su da zakone i ustav intepretiraju onako kako im se svidja (ukoliko, naravno, za to postoji prostor). Bas zbog toga i zbog toga sto sudijama realno niko nista ne moze nakon sto zasednu na svoje mesto se republikanci i demokrate toliko kolju oko toga ko ce da bude postavljen u Vrhovni sud.

[Eraserhead]

Русофоби скинули први скалп у Трамповој администрацији

 

 

WikiLeaks 

 

✔@wikileaks

Trump's National Security Advisor Michael Flynn resigns after destabilization campaign by US spies, Democrats, press https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C4nxw0SWEAAIIBF.jpg …

05:41 - 14 феб 2017

 

 

 

Sputnjikovci, wikileaks svi najbolji medju nama pate... 

 

Tuga pregolema

Edited February 17, 2017 by Eraserhead

[Tribun_Populi]

 

 

Sudije sude u skladu sa svojim ideoloskim uverenjima. Skloni su da zakone i ustav intepretiraju onako kako im se svidja (ukoliko, naravno, za to postoji prostor).

Nemere drukše u situaciji u kojoj iz najapstraktnije apstraktne norme (ustava) treba da izvedeš i kreiraš pravilo za konkretan slučaj, jer ne postoji zakon koji takvo pravilo propisuje (što je čest slučaj). Tamo sudija nije samo interpretator, već često i kreator zakona. Tu uvek nastupa doza subjektivnosti i učitava se lični pečat, jednostavno se ne može izbeći.

 

Ali je taj poredak znatno fleksibilniji a svoju stabilnost duguje upravo na stalnosti i potpunoj nezavisnosti sudijske funkcije, strogo razrađenoj podeli vlasti (checks&balances) te bespogovornom izvršavanju sudskih odluka od strane administracije.

 

via CZ-M53 TT

[Pečorin]

Uopste ne shvatam sta mediji pokusavaju da postignu sa konstantnim Tramp-uradio-ovo-Tramp-rekao-ono pristupom. Ponekad te vest nasmeje, ali sve cesce cini ljude ravnodusnim, retko koga sokira. Ni tokom izbora im nista nije pomooglo. I dalje se bave posledicom a ne uzrokom, zive u svom zatvorenom svetu. On sam nema srama, i savrseno pliva u tim skandalima, ko u rijaliti programu. Ako to ne shvataju, nek se spreme za 8 godina drugacijeg predsednikovanja.

Mozda to mnogi i zele, kako bi bili konstantno zgrozeni.

[Lord Protector]

The American Conservative

 

More About Russia and Less About Flynn?

 

Philip Giraldi On  February 16, 2017 

Philip Giraldi, a former CIA officer, is executive director of the Council for the National Interest.

 

The story on the resignation of National Security Advisor Michael Flynn is somewhat like peeling an onion, with each layer revealing something new. To be sure, I am delighted to see Flynn gone, both because of his clearly expressed desire to confront Iran and his inaccurate characterization of Islam. But Flynn’s departure will no doubt be exploited by many to justify increased hostility toward Russia, which is neither justified by circumstances nor in America’s long-term interests.

Ironically, I am not even sure if Flynn was ever really on the same page as his boss regarding relations with Moscow. The former advisor considered Russia one of a number of states that would be useful allies in the global war against “radical Islamic terrorism.” But at the same time, Flynn has been focused on a post-ISIS situation in which a transnational alignment of Iran, Russia, China, and other states all join a grand conspiracy to challenge American military supremacy and ultimately destroy the United States.

To be sure, there are parts of the Flynn tale that just do not make sense. How is it that an experienced intelligence officer would not instinctively know that a long-distance telephone call between a man relaxing at a beach resort in the Dominican Republic and the Russian ambassador in Washington would be intercepted by the National Security Agency? And knowing that, why would anyone lie about it, even if it did include some kind of discussion relating to the current round of sanctions on Russia, which is pretty unsensational material when all is said and done? Flynn certainly had a number of other discussions with foreign-intelligence officers before the Trump inaugural, including those of Israel and most likely Britain, without any scandal being imputed even though the talks must surely have included discussion of substantive issues. The difference is clearly the involvement of Russia.

The motivation for the leak of the apparent transcript of the phone call (or a summary of it) to the media must be considered. There are (more or less) four theories currently floating around regarding what happened and why. First, that it was vindictive members of the intelligence community (IC) getting even for Trump’s rude comments about them. Second, that it was a victory for the neoconservatives who want a national-security advisor who will be more openly willing to employ U.S. military power worldwide. Third, that it was honorable members of the IC acting as whistleblowers to expose the illegality ^[1] and blackmail potential of Flynn discussing policy with a foreign diplomat before he was actually in office. Fourth, that it was carried out by Obama holdovers getting revenge.

I don’t buy any of those explanations. In this case, the leak came out of the National Security Agency, Federal Bureau of Investigation, or possibly the Central Intelligence Agency (or all three) with the intent of bringing down a key political figure—thereby damaging a new White House and influencing policy formulation. It also appears to have involved multiple leakers, according to The Intercept ^[1]. That goes beyond vindictive, vengeful, exposing illegality, worrying about blackmail, or wanting to change horses. This was a leak that had specific policy implications.

Which leads to the possibility that the story about Flynn actually has little or nothing to do with either him personally or his having been indiscreet. How it developed and where it is leading might actually be much more about America’s Russian policy. Taking down Flynn, whose actual views on foreign policy vis-à-vis Iran and Russia are pretty closely aligned with those of the neoconservatives and many in Congress and the media, would hardly appear to be a suitable objective but for the fact that his irascible demeanor made him an easy mark for discrediting the entire Trump project. Now that he has been dismissed over contact with a Russian, Flynn is the stick that will be used to beat Vladimir Putin.

Everyone who matters in the United States is now rushing to demonize Russia, even though Moscow was pretty much a passive player in what happened and has subsequently developed. The narrative that Moscow somehow influenced the outcome of the recent U.S. election has not completely gone away, largely fueled by Democratic Party rage over the final result even though no hard evidence has ever been produced to support the allegations regarding Putin’s interference. Some senators, including John McCain and Lindsey Graham, have always been prepared to respond dramatically to Russian initiatives. And the media has been on an anti-Putin binge ever since the fighting over Georgia in 2008.

Quite a lot of what is now taking place is feeding off of a shift in perception in Washington. Russia is no longer seen as an adversary or competitor but as an enemy. This was clear in the Hillary Clinton campaign’s insistence on punishing Moscow, and it resonates in most mainstream-media coverage of any and all developments in Russia.

Some suggest that the intelligence community is also on board with this sentiment, though that is often dismissively attributed to a desire for larger budgets and increased turf in Washington. But my own recent encounters with intelligence officers of the current generation has led me to believe something quite different—that many people in the IC really have come to believe that Russia is a major and very active threat against the United States, just like in the old days with the Soviet Union. I assume they have come to that conclusion through their understanding of developments in Syria and Ukraine, but I nevertheless fail to understand how they have adopted that point of view given the real limitations on Russian power. Whatever the reason, they believe in their Russophobia passionately, and I have discovered that arguing with those who are fixated on Moscow as the fons et origo of global chaos is futile.

To my mind, this makes the officials who shared the phone transcripts much more dangerous than conventional leakers motivated by some personal grievance or desire to right a wrong. I fear that the current crop of Russia skeptics are true believers of the worst kind and will do whatever it takes to disrupt any moves toward rapprochement between Washington and Moscow. Exposing a highly classified sigint-derived phone call of a soon-to-be high U.S. official might reasonably be described as an extreme initiative.

So it seems that the destruction of Flynn, involving as it may have a number of leakers coming from all across the intelligence community, might be part of a coordinated effort to narrow the Trump White House’s options for dealing with Russia. Many in Washington do not want a comfortable working relationship with Putin in spite of the fact that a reset with Moscow should be the No. 1 national-security objective. There are already multiple investigations of Russia underway in Congress with calls for more, but exploiting the vulnerable Flynn might have been seen as providing the best opportunity to do something really disruptive before any change in the direction of foreign policy can take place.

 

Edited February 17, 2017 by slow

[Weenie Pooh]

Uopste ne shvatam sta mediji pokusavaju da postignu sa konstantnim Tramp-uradio-ovo-Tramp-rekao-ono pristupom. Ponekad te vest nasmeje, ali sve cesce cini ljude ravnodusnim, retko koga sokira. Ni tokom izbora im nista nije pomooglo. I dalje se bave posledicom a ne uzrokom, zive u svom zatvorenom svetu. On sam nema srama, i savrseno pliva u tim skandalima, ko u rijaliti programu. Ako to ne shvataju, nek se spreme za 8 godina drugacijeg predsednikovanja.

Mozda to mnogi i zele, kako bi bili konstantno zgrozeni.

 

Pokušavaju da održe gledanost, naravno, i to im verovatno uspeva. Nisu se stvari još toliko promenile da bi mejnstrim mediji pokušali da se otvoreno angažuju. Jeste da Olbermann na YT vodi svoj La Resistance ali takvih mahnitih nema mnogo. 

[hazard]

Pokušavaju da održe gledanost, naravno, i to im verovatno uspeva. 

 

+1

 

Trampovci gledaju i kazu "ekekeke, vidi sta im radi!"

Anti-Trampovci gledaju i kukaju "jao jao jao vidi sta nam radi!"

 

A i i jedni i drugi zalepljeni za TV.