Grčka - enormni dug, protesti oko mera štednje

[adam]

Nema od te parlamentarne akcije ništa. Stari pajtosi iz ND jedva čekaju da ponovo uzjašu i Cipras to odlično zna. Ovaj ekvivalent ratnoj kapitulaciji na koji su pristali, glatko će proći kroz parlament.

 

A kada bude krenula primena svih ovih mera po bulji birača, ti birači će na izborima oterati i Ciprasa i Syrizu i stare pajtose u tri lepe, i isprobati nekog drugog. Pogodi koga, Angela, idiote da bi idiote.

ne znam. meni se cini da to nece tako lako proci u parlamentu.

 

a sto se tice promene vlasti - ako narod zaista popizdi, vece sanse dajem staroj dobroj vojnoj hunti nego bilo kojoj politickoj opciji.

[vememah]

Vrlo iscrpan intervju sa Varufakisom, evo malo tizera:

 

HL: And is that group controlled by German attitudes?

YV: Oh completely and utterly. Not attitudes – by the finance minister of Germany. It is all like a very well-tuned orchestra and he is the director. Everything happens in tune. There will be times when the orchestra is out of tune, but he convenes and puts it back in line.

HL: Is there no alternative power within the group, can the French counter that power?

YV: Only the French finance minister has made noises that were different from the German line, and those noises were very subtle. You could sense he had to use very judicious language, to be seen not to oppose. And in the final analysis, when Doc Schäuble responded and effectively determined the official line, the French FM in the end would always fold and accept.

...

HL: You must have been thinking about a Grexit from day one...

YV: Yes, absolutely. 

HL: ...have preparations been made?

YV: The answer is yes and no. We had a small group, a ‘war cabinet’ within the ministry, of about five people that were doing this: so we worked out in theory, on paper, everything that had to be done [to prepare for/in the event of a Grexit]. But it’s one thing to do that at the level of 4-5 people, it’s quite another to prepare the country for it. To prepare the country an executive decision had to be taken, and that decision was never taken.

HL: And in the past week, was that a decision you felt you were leaning towards [preparing for Grexit]?

YV: My view was, we should be very careful not to activate it. I didn’t want this to become a self-fulfilling prophecy. I didn’t want this to be like Nietzsche’s famous dictum that if you stare into the abyss long enough, the abyss will stare back at you. But I also believed that at the moment the Eurogroup shut out banks down, we should energise this process.

 

http://www.newstatesman.com/world-affairs/2015/07/yanis-varoufakis-full-transcript-our-battle-save-greece

[malkin]

Po telefonskoj anketi nemačke stanice n-tv 88% učesnika misli da Merkelova nije bila dovoljno oštra prema Grcima.

 

sumnjam da je istraživanje naročito relevantno, ali zapravo 88% misli da nije bila previše oštra.

[Аврам Гојић]

Možda ih je danas nedovoljno ali za par godina ih može biti sasvim dovoljno. Zar nisu dali Zlatnoj zori dvocifrenu podršku posle samo par godina mera koje su bile med i mleko u poredjenju sa ovim što ih sad čeka?

 

Bojim se da je bakuta malkice previše ponesena srpskom sposobnošću da se apsolutno sve istrpi bez pogovora, pa misli da to svuda tako ide. No dobro, dao bog da grešim i da će Grci sve ovo sportski otrpeti.

 

Zlatna zora ima granicu rasta koja je, po mom misljenju, daleko ispod minimuma potrebnog za ozbiljnu participaciju u vlasti.

[vememah]

@malkin:

 

Hvala na ispravci.

 

Možda ih je danas nedovoljno ali za par godina ih može biti sasvim dovoljno. Zar nisu dali Zlatnoj zori dvocifrenu podršku posle samo par godina mera koje su bile med i mleko u poredjenju sa ovim što ih sad čeka?

 

Koju dvocifrenu podršku?

 

Rezultati Zlatne zore na izborima:

VI 2012. 6,92%
V 2014. (za Evropski parlament) 9,39%
I 2015. 6,28%

Edited July 13, 2015 by vememah

[Muwan]

OK onda, sve je pod kontrolom. Svom snagom u reforme.

[Аврам Гојић]

OK onda, sve je pod kontrolom. Svom snagom u reforme.

 

 pa nije nista pod kontrolom, samo mislim da od ZZ ne preti neka posebna opasnost i da postoji jak containment te opcije koji, pre svega, pociva na cinjenici da je u pitanju kriminalni olos za koji tesko glasaju i vatreni desnicari.

[Muwan]

Uvažavam, preterao sam. Ali nekako imam loš dugoročni predosećaj.

[Marcus Wulffings]

kako mi je sestričina rekla, ti iz ΧΡΥΣΗ ΑΥΓΗ su gomila batinaša koji organizovano haraju po periferijama gradova i rasteruju one migrante sirijce, iračane i kineze koji prodaju robu po buvljacima, njih isprebijaju a robu pocepaju i unište

[vememah]

Greece capitulates to creditors’ demands – Bloomberg

 

Greek Prime Minister Alexis Tsipras surrendered to European demands for immediate action to qualify for up to 86 billion euros of aid Greece needs to stay in the euro, Bloomberg reported.

 

After a six-month offensive against German-inspired austerity succeeded only in deepening his country’s economic mess and antagonizing his European counterparts, there was no face-saving compromise on offer for Tsipras at a rancorous summit that ran for more than 17 hours.

 

“Trust has to be rebuilt, the Greek authorities have to take on responsibility for what they agreed to,” German Chancellor Angela Merkel said after the meeting ended just before 9 a.m. in Brussels Monday. “It now hinges on step-by-step implementation of what we agreed.”

 

The agreement shifts the spotlight to the parliament in Athens, where lawmakers from Tsipras’s Syriza party mutinied when he sought their endorsement two days ago for spending cuts, pensions savings and tax increases. They have until Wednesday to pass into law key creditor demands, including stream ling value-added taxes, broadening the tax base to increase revenue and curbing pension costs.

 

While the summit agreement averted a worst-case outcome for Greece, it only established the basis for negotiations on an aid package, which would also include 25 billion euros to recapitalize its weakened financial system.

 

The Stoxx Europe 600 Index climbed 1.5 percent at 9:55 a.m. in London, while futures on the Standard & Poor’s 500 Index erased a drop to rise 0.3 percent.

 

With Greece running out of money and its banks shut the past two weeks, the summit was billed as its last chance to stay in the euro. Greece has been in financial limbo since the government missed a payment to the International Monetary Fund and allowed its second rescue package to lapse on June 30.

 

“The Greek government has accepted practically everything,” Maltese Prime Minister Joseph Muscat said in an interview. “It accepted all the crucial and important points.”

 

The conditions that Tsipras swallowed comprised a laundry list of unfinished business from Greece’s two previous bailouts and a new demand for the government to transfer 50 billion euros of state assets to a holding company that will seek to either sell or generate cash from them. His creditors rejected Tsipras’s pleas for a cut in the face value of Greek debt of about 310 billion euros.

 

Merkel said interest-payment grace periods and longer maturities will “be discussed once there is a successful evaluation of the new Greek program.”

 

As the summit approached its climax in the early hours of Monday, the main session broke at least four times to allow Tsipras to confer with associates in Athens, according to one official with knowledge of the talks. Tsipras told the creditors he’d enforce party discipline in parliament, the official said. The terms are significantly tougher than those he labelled “blackmail” when he persuaded Greek voters to reject them in a referendum a week ago.

 

Calling that vote “has turned into one of the most expensive economic policy mistakes in the European Union for a long time,” Holger Schmieding, chief economist at Berenberg Bank in London, said in a note to clients Monday. “The much bigger sums which creditors now need to offer and the tougher conditions Greece now has to meet make it harder for both sides to deliver on the bargain.”

 

In addition to requirements on pensions and sales taxes, measures that Tsipras accepted last week, the leaders demanded that creditor representatives return to Athens with full access to ministers and a veto over relevant legislation, intrusions that he has long rejected.

 

“We had to succeed,” said French President Francois Hollande. “If Greece had left the euro zone what would the world have said? That the euro zone wasn’t able to maintain its integrity? That Greece couldn’t assume its responsibilities? That France and Germany couldn’t propel this project forward?”

 

The cost of insuring corporate debt declined, pushing the Markit iTraxx Europe Index to a five-week low. The gauge of credit-default swaps covering investment-grade companies fell two basis points to 66 basis points. The Markit iTraxx Europe Senior Financial Index slid four basis points to 75 basis points.

 

Tsipras said that the deal had prevented the banking system collapsing but will inevitably harm the economy. He’ll return to Greece to face a political backlash that may force him to organize a government of national unity or call new elections after retreating from his campaign promises to lift wages and throw off the yoke of austerity.

 

“We put up a hard fight for the past six months and we fought to the end in order to get the best out of it, to get a deal which will allow the country to stand on its feet and the Greek people to keep fighting,” Tsipras said in Brussels.

 

Nikos Filis, the parliamentary spokesman for Tsipras’s governing party, said that Greece had been “waterboarded” by euro-area leaders during the negotiations and accused Germany of “tearing Europe apart” for the third time in the past century. “#ThisIsACoup” became the most-trending Twitter hashtag in both Greece and Germany overnight.

 

Greece’s banks remain shut and capital controls will remain in place when they reopen, as soon as this week if there’s a deal, Economy Minister George Stathakis told Mega TV.

 

The banks are expected to stay closed on Monday, so the ECB won’t need to adjust its now-frozen emergency credit line to the banks right away, an EU official said as leaders were meeting. The ECB’s Governing Council is slated to review the banks’ situation again on Monday when the Greek government is set to renew a bank holiday and capital controls decree expiring today.

 

http://en.enikos.gr/economy/32376,Greece-capitulates-to-creditors-demands--Bloomberg.html

 

Two officials who observed Tsipras at the Brussels showdown independently described him as a “beaten dog” whose only remaining option was to submit to the creditors’ will, carving out a concession here and there. Tsipras fretted privately about the reception that awaits him in Athens.

 

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-07-13/tsipras-moves-from-predator-to-prey-at-euro-torture-summit

Edited July 13, 2015 by vememah

[adam]

ako sam imao i trunku sumnje da ova travestija od uslova nije sadisticko gazenje grka, vise zaista nemam. posle ovoga nema sanse da glasam za ostanak u eu. 

 

 

One intriguing detail with the EU statement: as part of market reforms designed to boost the economy, Greece will have to bring in Sunday trading hours.

[Marcus Wulffings]

neće ga najtoplije dočekati u atini

[morgana]

stvarno nije potrebno da mi objasnjavas da je u pitanju kredit a ne poklon

[vememah]

neće ga najtoplije dočekati u atini

 

Njegovi u partiji, da. Međutim, neki obični ljudi su se pomirili sa sudbinom:

 

Greeks seem to be taking the agreement and accompanying harsh measures in stride, with many saying they understand more pain is on the way but that it is far better than an alternative that would have pushed Greece out of the Eurozone.

Periklis Stinios, a 38-year-old lawyer walking through Athens' central Syntagma Squre, described the deal as "a historic opportunity ... for the young generation. Because the previous ones didn't manage to rise to the occasion."

Panagiotis Toutsidis, a retired private sector employee, says the Greek people got what they were expecting, which was a deal. He says it's much better than a Grexit and that the country is used to such measures.

Kostas Lambos, a retired economist, said things would be "difficult in the beginning" until people understand that "this was a necessary step for the country to emerge from the dead ends that had been created in the last few years."

http://bigstory.ap.org/article/a1a7ca0841374febb31754c48526718f/latest-eurozone-summit-greece-drags-past-deadline

 

[Аврам Гојић]

Sudeci po izjavama odgovornih i mudrih politicara iz ND i Pasoka, koji uopste nisu doveli do ovog stanja i za sve je kriva koalicija koja je na vlasti 5 meseci, predlog ce proci u parlamentu sa dvotrecinskom vecinom.